Williston, ND Active Issues

stacyslap · Veteran Member

RE: United States Health Care Plan.

vko · Senior Member

So far looking through this plan and the Employer Part would get nailed for hugh amounts for Employee's and their famlies. So much for being in business. I also do not like the IRS being in our lives even more so. (I do not think Obama care is nothing other than he only care's about himself) It is a total left, left plan. Don"t get me wrong, health care and insurance needs working on. Edited by vko on Tuesday 6th of October 2009 06:21:39 PM

-- Edited by vko on Wednesday 7th of October 2009 07:09:37 PM

cantac · Veteran Member

rwaitman wrote:
That mullet is awesome...

Thanks. Yeah I had to cut it recently, was going through a bottle of conditioner a week, getting too expensive to maintain.

rwaitman · Senior Member

I didn't see any anger or hatred in jimmilikesvikes post? Did I miss something somewhere? The innate sarcasm...not very well hidden, serves no purpose....there is sarcasm and then there is sarcasm....

That mullet is awesome....is that really you.....or is it just a joke like my flying pig?

;o)

R

Jimmylikesvikes · Veteran Member

cantac wrote:

It's broken due to COST. You clearly don't understand that, so there's no point in me wasting any more time here. Learn something besides your anger and hatred and come back to us. Okay thanks bye

contac, I guess I didn't understand that. I thought it was more complicated than that.. my bad again. Perhaps you can educate me.

cantac · Veteran Member

It's broken due to COST. You clearly don't understand that, so there's no point in me wasting any more time here. Learn something besides your anger and hatred and come back to us. Okay thanks bye

Jimmylikesvikes · Veteran Member

OK, let's start from the beginning. Our health care system is broken. Let's start by talking about what's broken. I totally get that there are some things that need improving. But rather than saying "we need a new health care system", let's talk about why? And what cost? And how? And who? Do you really want our government taking this over. Government track record is not doing well in running anything, right? Or are they successful?

The reality is, this administration will add a few bills to our existing system and call it a new health care system. And true reality is, it will be our existing health care system with lipstick. And I'm OK with that.

cantac · Veteran Member

vko wrote:

Thank You and I will study it. But that is my problem, I do not want any one negotiating my Health Care. Did you know that when you turn 65 that if you do not go on medicare, because you want your companies Health Care, you can not get on Social Security that you have paid into your whole life? I just heard that on talk radio today from a person who wants to keep his Health Care he has, but then has to give up his Social Security Payment. Don't ask me where to find that one. I do not know.

Why? I don't know, I'm working on finding an answer though, other than "the government is greedy". Seems to me it is more expensive to cover a senior's health than it is to pay them those small social security checks. You'd think they'd want you to drop out of Medicare to help save money in that bucket. This policy was enacted in 1993 under Clinton, who knows, they probably just shoved it through without spending much time on it, all 3 branches were BLUE like today so we can blame the liberals.

vko · Senior Member

Thank You and I will study it. But that is my problem, I do not want any one negotiating my Health Care. Did you know that when you turn 65 that if you do not go on medicare, because you want your companies Health Care, you can not get on Social Security that you have paid into your whole life? I just heard that on talk radio today from a person who wants to keep his Health Care he has, but then has to give up his Social Security Payment. Don't ask me where to find that one. I do not know.

cantac · Veteran Member

vko wrote:

Well then could you direct me to Obama's Plan - the exact one that all have read - and the one they will be voting on.. It keeps changing with the wind. The one that will care for me when I run out of 1200.00 a month that it is costing me now - personally with my husband. I would be more than happy to read it and then discuss it.

-- Edited by vko on Sunday 4th of October 2009 08:03:43 PM

Here you go, http://www.opencongress.org/bill/111-h3200/text as introduced, and you can browse the site for updates, amendments, and dictation from the floor. And of course it "changes with the wind", it's supposed to. All bills do. They amend based on negotiations to get the number of votes needed (for bills that do pass). It's a work in progress as I alluded to in my early post.

Have fun with it. It's a terribly exciting read.

rwaitman · Senior Member

Touche'

;o)

R

vko · Senior Member

Well then could you direct me to Obama's Plan - the exact one that all have read - and the one they will be voting on.. It keeps changing with the wind. The one that will care for me when I run out of 1200.00 a month that it is costing me now - personally with my husband. I would be more than happy to read it and then discuss it.

-- Edited by vko on Sunday 4th of October 2009 08:03:43 PM

cantac · Veteran Member

Look, Obamacare is being debated everywhere on the Internet. If you want to discuss it, I'd suggest debating it's local implications. How and what is ND's role? Conrad has been a champion of reform for health care, shooting down Obama's public option and introducing a co-op type of plan. How would a co-op affect ND? Well as a stand alone state, it wouldn't be able to compete with private health insurers. States with huge populations such as CA and NY can hold their own co-op but I'd lump together the lightly populated midwestern states and I think that's what Conrad is looking to do....and it makes sense economically for those states that don't have enough population to co-op competitively. The other side of the coin is that this type of insurance wouldn't necessarily be run by the Federal government, it would leave a lot of power to the states but oversight by the Fed (I could imagine). Anyway...I'm not going to break this up into easy-to-read paragraphs nor will I proof read this, I hope my blabbering has made sense.

brokenchain · Member

Way to redirect the issue..... evileye

vko · Senior Member

I guess if I really gave a crap about that I would do something about it.

cantac · Veteran Member

vko wrote:

I will go on this plan if, and only if, the President and his family - Congress and their families - Senator's and their families, are on the very exact plan. And treated exactly as the rest of us American's.

vko, do you know that you don't have to put an apostrophe (') after every plural noun? Maybe if your daily Fox News brainwashing was replaced with Grammar Therapy you'd know that.

-- Edited by cantac on Sunday 4th of October 2009 12:17:38 AM

cantac · Veteran Member

It's looking like we won't have to worry about it, Conrad was one Dem who recently shot down the Public Option as expected and it looks like he won't ever support it.

rwaitman · Senior Member

Jib has very succintly described the gist of the entire problem. Those people who are down on their luck, out of work, and on hard times should be helped.

I don't think any American citizen would question that....the people of the United States, collectively, and despite our many disagreements and ideological differences are probably the most selflessly giving people in the world. Having it shoved down your throat is a little tough to swallow though, particularly when you are not being listened to.

There is NO question that affordable, quality, and timely health care should be available to everyone, and I for sure, do not have the answers, but it seems to me, that an approach of increasing the scope of medicare and medicaid, social security, and social services might be a better way to improve availability rather than a wholesale willy nilly restructuring of the entire health care system.

Deadbeats, and those who gamble that their health will not be bad and make the choice not to be covered should be responsible for their own decisions. The estimated 80% or better of the country who are mostly satisfied with their health care program should be listened to.
;o)
R

Jibslider · Senior Member

brokenchain wrote:

Why doesn't the government start with regulating the health insurance companies reimbursment to healthcare facilities? Maybe, invest a little more time and energy in healthy lifestyle education? Seems to me this is where the problem starts.

From a health care worker this makes absolute sense. The reimbursement rate and the sheer difficulty of navigating the policies so you get paid the appropriate amount needs to be addressed. The amount of staff required and the time it takes to train your staff to navigate and bill insurance correctly drives up the cost of health care to the patients enormously!

Now, from a general public view point, this might not make much sense, and if policy target this area only, it will seem to them that the government is just making doctors more rich (even though that is not the case). Politicians, especially those of the democratic party are going to target their policies so that it benefits the public in a bottom-up (poor to rich) manner in order to win support of "Joe 6-pack".

From an ethical standpoint it makes the most sense to get people that can not afford health care some sort of policy they can afford and it actually be useful. I know there's much more to it than that, but in reality that is what it should distill down to... getting people that are out of work and on hard times some health care.

brokenchain · Member

Why doesn't the government start with regulating the health insurance companies reimbursment to healthcare facilities? Maybe, invest a little more time and energy in healthy lifestyle education? Seems to me this is where the problem starts. disbelief

Steve Powell · Guru

One of the best things I've done is taken advantage of the Health Flex Spending account. I know it doesn't work for everyone considering the number of people without jobs. But since the government feels it has to interfere in every part of our lives, can't it mandate to businesses that they all establish a health flex spending account and make it obligatory for employees to sign up for it? These accounts are pre-taxed dollars and become a savings account specifically for health care costs.

The only issue I have with our current account is that we can't roll dollars over from year to year. The money has to be spent that very year or you lose it. I would think health care premiums would come down dramatically if everyone were to have an option like this that would allow us to save over the years for medical emergencies and to take care of even minor nagging injuries or illnesses.

Thoughts?

Jimmylikesvikes · Veteran Member

I am not against the government reducing health care costs. But I am against the government running the health care system and in doing so, provide socialized medicine. I have teammates from several countries in Europe. Socialized medicine is not the cure-all - no pun intended. In fact, the waiting queue for critical surgeries, and the huge increase in taxes to pay for medicine isn't a path we really want to go down. There is good reason why folks from other countries come to the good ole' USA to get medical treatment. Albeit our health care system isn't perfect, it is one of the best. There will always be horrific health care stories as many people experience tremendous amount of pain and tremendous amount of emotion while dealing with health issues or watching a loved one deal with health problems. Socialized medicine does not create a land of "everybody is happy". The increase in demand for medicine and increased demand for doctors in such an environment continues to be a struggle in socialized run health care systems. The reality is is our government and it's strict regulations on medicine is part of the problem. Frivolous lawsuits, the right to "perfect" medicine, is also part of the huge costs in providing lower cost health care. For example, recently they have found that Zicam (a zinc based nose spray) can cause loss of smell. Many including myself have used Zicam when feeling a cold coming on. Should we seek damages or should we take responsibility in knowing that there will always be risks in taking any kind of medicine.

vko · Senior Member

I know...I don't know which way to jump. Brother in Law got 5 by passes after hiking in the Utah Mountains, sis called 911... those doctors told him to continue hiking... no sign of a heart attack.. Just keep up your good works.. and be in the faces that can actually help the US and not just use it. And Rant all you want. I have to add they are from Montana and helping to put this plan in place (Democrates Plan) I pay BCBS premium every month. It is more than most house payments (in Williston anyway) Either way it is not right.. government will not help you and the premiums are going up every year. I guess the answer is as some health givers that took care of my parents said "you know that it is time for them to die". So at what age is it time for us to die? Why have health insurance when people choose that , after you pay the premiums. I am at that age..Your not.

-- Edited by vko on Monday 22nd of June 2009 09:40:39 PM

Jibslider · Senior Member

vko wrote:

I will go on this plan if, and only if, the President and his family - Congress and their families - Senator's and their families, are on the very exact plan. And treated exactly as the rest of us American's.

Don't worry, health insurance companies won't allow congress to stop them from controlling how medicine is practiced in this country. Why let doctor's decide how you are cared for?

I'm not saying the Obama plan will accomplish any different, I'm just ranting.

gundo · Senior Member

just like they use the same social security plan we are all paying into to for "our future".

right

vko · Senior Member

I will go on this plan if, and only if, the President and his family - Congress and their families - Senator's and their families, are on the very exact plan. And treated exactly as the rest of us American's.